UN Geneva - Multimedia Newsroom : HRC - Press conference: UN Special Rapporteur on Myanmar 20 March 2023

Good afternoon.

Thank you for joining us today for this press conference.

My name is Maya Dorwas.

I'm a media officer with the UN Human Rights Office.

Today we have with us the UN Special Rapporteur on the situation in my situation in Myanmar, Mr Thomas Andrews.

He will.

We will start with a few remarks from him and then we'll open the floor to questions.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Good afternoon everyone.

I'm not going to torture you with a long drawn out opening statement.

We'll try to get to Q&A and engagement as as soon as possible.

But I just spoke with, met with the Human Rights Council.

I gave them a update of conditions in in Myanmar, which included the fact that opposition has never been stronger, that the junta is in fact losing ground in the country.

That opposition is widespread.

As a matter of fact, the the junta has been responding to its current condition by doubling down on human rights abuses and attacks on on people because it is increasingly dangerous for their troops on the ground.

They have been increasingly using air power, helicopter gunships and and jet fighters to attack villages.

They've been destroying schools and hospitals and centres for displaced displaced persons.

So the the effect of that has been just the opposite of what the junta was hoping.

Instead of terrifying people and having them back off of their opposition, it is galvanised opposition, it has strengthened the opposition.

And so you have an extraordinary situation within the country that that continues with great intensity.

There are more than 3000 people, civilians have been killed and that number is very conservative.

It's it's significantly more than that.

But those that we know well over 3100, more than 1.3 million have been displaced since the coup, or a total of 1.6 million in total.

And there's now a projection that in this year alone, there will be an additional 1.4 million people displaced in in Myanmar.

There are more than 16,000 political prisoners in the in the country and that that is growing.

There are 17.6 million in dire need of humanitarian aid.

Nearly half of the country has fallen into poverty.

State institutions have been hollowed out.

The rule of law has collapsed.

So conditions within the country are at A at a horrible, horrible state.

And to make it all worse, the brutality of the of the of the the hunters forces continues, continues the pace.

And that is why I've been speaking to the Human Rights Council.

What I'm constantly asked, OK, what can we do about all of this?

First of all, we need to speak out very loudly and very clearly.

The people of Myanmar, and I talked to many people inside of Myanmar, frankly believe that they have been forgotten by a distracted world, that they were no longer on the proverbial radar screen.

We've got to do everything that we can to make that make it clear that they're not forgotten, that we stand with them.

The leaders have been speaking out very strongly, which is a very good thing.

The Human Rights Council, the General Assembly and the Security Council have all passed strong resolutions of condemnation of the coup and the violence.

But we need to do more and we need, it is critically important that we do better as an international community.

We're we're not doing enough.

The Security Council should build upon its resolution of last December by seizing its Chapter 7 authority and establishing a an artist embargo, targeted economic sanctions, as well as a reference to the International Criminal Court.

Very important given the fact that it is unlikely that that is going to happen in the foreseeable future.

It is precisely why those countries who support the people of Myanmar and are committed to standing with them do so in a coordinated, targeted, focused manner.

Right now, the various measures that are being taken, including sanctions, targeted economic sanctions are being done in, you know, various countries are exercising various sanctions, but they're they're not connected and, and there's been no analysis.

OK, what can we do that will have the greatest impact?

Let's identify the greatest vulnerability of the junta and then let's coordinate all of our actions so that we target those, pick those points of greatest vulnerability and act and act together.

So for example, the European Union has been the only entity who have stepped forward, has stepped forward to impose sanctions on the oil and gas industry in in Myanmar.

This is the largest single source of revenue for the junta, $1.5 billion per year.

So if you want to do something significant, cut off access to the revenue that they're using to commit human rights violations, war crimes and crimes against humanity, but do it in a coordinated way.

And that has yet to be done.

So that is my one of my primary recommendations to the council and I, I'm kind of a broken record, to tell you the truth.

I've been saying this a lot, but I reiterate it because the need for it gets even greater.

The other thing I talked about today was the great need for humanitarian aid, and the fact is we have failed miserably as an international community to providing the basic resources necessary to save lives.

The joint response plan, for example, that is critically important for the nearly 1,000,000 Rainga people who are in Bangladesh and in the camps in Bangladesh, only 63% of that programme was funded.

Last year, only 63%.

And just two weeks ago, the World Food Programme announced that they were cutting food rations to the people of of the Rainga populations in these camps.

Now I've been talking to families, moms and dads, about what the impact of this is going to be.

And, and a mother told me, she said, look, you've got to understand we've already been making cuts because the cost of food continues to rise.

So we've already had to make very difficult choices about what we're going to cut out from our children's diet.

In point of fact, over 40% of Rohingya children in these camps are suffering from stunted growth.

Over half of them are anaemic, as are breastfeeding women and pregnant women.

So this is a crisis even before these cuts kicked in.

But now for a lack of $125 million, a 17% cut went into, went went into force on the 1st of March.

And I'm told that additional cuts are going to be made if this fund is not filled, if we don't make up the $125 million shortfall in this World Food Programme fund.

What that means is that individuals in these camps are facing a food ration of the value of $0.27 per day per person, 27th.

So try living on $0.27 per day.

And that is what the Brainga are forced to live on now in inside of Myanmar.

It's also, it's also a crisis.

And what's happening is that many of the populations within Myanmar are having what humanitarian aid exists blockaded by the hunter, particularly in those areas where opposition to the hunter is particularly strong.

So there are, as I mentioned today in my presentation, there are CS OS organisation, civil society organisations that have developed this very extremely powerful, sophisticated network within the country that can get food and humanitarian aid into these populations that are not being served.

And who's aid or otherwise being blockaded.

But for the lack of resources, they could be providing millions of people inside this Myanmar itself with food and humanitarian aid.

So I, I encouraged member states to meet their obligations for humanitarian aid, both for people inside and outside of the country and to do it in, in creative ways.

And Speaking of creative ways, one of the things that the UK and Canada has begun doing, for example, in terms of sanctions and weapons ban is they've they've begun to sanction jet fuel.

And the idea is if, if, if it's more difficult and expensive to fly these planes it that are bombing villages and hospitals and schools, we may see fewer sorties going in and bombing schools and, and and so forth.

So we're hoping that that countries are going to do this.

Last but not least, and I know I, I told you at the beginning I wasn't going to give you a long boring opening, but here I go and here I am.

I apologise, but the question of legitimacy, I, I published a conference room paper a few months ago on the question of legitimacy and I showed and demonstrated in that paper just how and why the junta, even by its own standards, but certainly by international standards, is illegitimate.

And how it's critically important for nations, nations of the world to not either purposefully or inadvertently legitimise this, this hunter.

Don't engage in this with the hunter as if they're a legitimate government.

Don't participate in FORA in which the junta participates.

Make sure that this attempt to legitimise themselves by orchestrating what they're calling an election later this year.

Don't legitimise this so-called election.

It's not going to be an election.

You cannot have an election where you arrest, detain, torture and execute leaders of the opposition.

So any, any legitimising or even assistance, election assistance to the to the convening of this so-called election would be to aid and abet a fraud and it would be aiding and abetting those who are committing systematic human rights violations, including war crimes and crimes against humanity.

So it's extremely important that we provide the resources that people need to survive, that we take away from the junta the means by which they can continue their attacks, including a weapons ban and including targeted economic sanctions that are coordinated.

It's important that we hold those who are responsible for these atrocities fully accountable.

And it's critically important that we stand with those who, for no fault of their own, are suffering inside of the country and also have been forced to escape outside of the country.

So that was my message in essence today and I'd be very happy to answer any questions that you might might have.

Thank you Mr Andrews.

So first we will take questions from the room and then move to those online.

Please state the name of your, your name and the name of the organisation you work for.

Thank you.

Gabrielle Toll fibre from murders, new news agency.

When you say that we're trying to coordinate that you would like to see a coordinated response in a distracted world.

How does that happen?

What's your vision for that to to be the case in in the current context, in concrete, in a concrete manner?

Thank you.

Well, there are instances in which a a country will announce sanctions and say, and we're doing this in conjunction with the UK or Canada or the EU or the United States.

So there is precedent for some coordination between some countries.

So what I'm saying is let's build on that, convene a session, actually have a build a coalition and convene a coalition of nations who are willing to stand with and for the people of me and more.

And then conduct the analysis of the crisis, how working together, these countries can do the most good and then coordinate together the implementation of sanctions and and an arms embargo.

And an example of how what that would look like is what happened after the invasion of Ukraine.

Even though the Security Council, for obvious reasons, was not going to pass a exercise Chapter 7 authority to take action, there was a convening of a number of countries to create a coordinated, comprehensive response to that that that crisis.

And don't get me wrong, the people of Myanmar, 2O one who I've spoken with support the people of Ukraine and support the world standing with them.

But many of them have asked us, have asked me what about us?

Why not us?

And to be honest with you, I don't have an answer to that question.

And I think that we need to do a lot more to show them that no, we, we, we can focus on various crises in the world and at the same time be focused on what's happening to all of you.

This is a the, the, the, the cost of human life.

The, the consequences of this are just horrific.

But I, but here's the other thing.

I think that we really could have an impact.

I mean, under current conditions, the opposition is, is strengthening, it's gaining the, the, the junta is weakening.

They have less control of the country than they did at the beginning of this coup.

So we could make a very significant difference if we increased our support and we coordinated that support.

I think we could see some very concrete results.

I think it would make a world of difference to tell you the truth.

Thank.

You Yeah, find it coming, Bruce, for New York Times.

The the statement that the hunter is losing ground.

I I wonder if you could quantify that a bit.

Yeah, they're using more air attacks, but these seem to be focused in in very specific geographic areas.

And a lot of the hunters military losses seem to be in very specific geographic areas.

So when you say it's losing ground, I wonder if you can quantify, you know, you know, the extent to which it's losing ground in more and more and more of the country than before.

And just as a follow up to that, there's been a lot of talk recently about a, a particular massacre in a monastery, which I think you also referred to, and I wondered if you had been able to confirm those details.

Well, let me first of all say that there have been some interesting analysis, graphic analysis of the, the loss of, of, of, of territory, the weakening of the, of the junta.

You know, before the coup, as you I'm sure know that the many of the ethnic states were at, have been at for some time in conflict with the authorities in, in Nipada and and Yangon.

But what we've so that so there's that territory to start with.

The areas that are under extreme conflict right now are, are, are not minority states.

These are majority Berman areas, Sagayan, for example.

And so the control of these areas is, is, is weakening when in fact, one of the analysis shows that the junta has a lack of control and now of over half the half of the country between these areas that are under that are heavily contested, those areas that have traditionally been contested the, the, the ethnic states.

And I found it was very interesting.

I, I saw a, a leaked document a few months ago of a meeting that was held with the leaders, the generals of the various regions of the country.

And we, we, we found that this was a legitimate document.

It was, it was not a fake document.

And it was fascinating to read this in which all of the commanders were identifying their situation and projecting what will happen in this year, 2023.

And they all were talking about their deep concerns about the losses that they've sustained, the increasing strength of the opposition.

And they all predicted that more ground was going to be lost in 2023.

So it's, you know, it's clear that and, and, and there's various analysis that's out there that can that, that look at the map and kind of quantify where, where these divisions lie.

But it's very clear to me that they have been losing ground and even they believe they're going to continue to be losing ground.

The massacre you refer to in which three monks were, were slaughtered, in fact, where people thought that they would be safe going into a monastery for protection, they weren't.

And the Tamidar soldiers went in and just somewhere early executed them, including including monks.

So that is a very real, very tangible example of the brutality.

But it is the only thing that's exceptional about it is that it got some attention, public attention.

And, but a lot of this is going on very systematically behind, behind closed doors and, and it's not receiving the, the requisite attention.

And that's that's part of my job.

Sorry, just to to press you on that a little bit.

I mean everybody talks about Sagang and I'm just wondering if there are a lot of main, you know, majority Berman other states that you can say are also now increasingly areas with are sort of no go areas for more of the of the ground forces of the terminal.

Well, that entire area, that entire region is, is, is is the case Bagway there Tin State.

We just learned that there are forces that are make making their way into Tin State and there are lots of alarms that are going off about what that could, what that could mean.

But it is the, I guess the, the, the bottom line is, is that this is something that is occurring nationwide and the, the, the clear trend is nationwide.

And it's unlike what thing, the way things have been in the past.

And you know, I'll tell you, I've had people tell me from these areas, Bourbon areas, that they just didn't believe it when we were talking about atrocities by the, the, the hunter forces, for example, the, the genocidal attacks of 2017 in Rakhine State that forced more than 700,000 people over the border into Bangladesh.

A lot of people didn't believe it.

And, and they, they have told me that they just didn't believe it, that, that they, their military forces would be capable of doing such a thing.

It had to have been made-up.

They believe it now.

And they told me that they were deeply sorry, that they did not say anything.

They didn't take action.

And it's now only when they are under attack that they realise just what a monster they have in their very midst.

Thank you.

Next question, Magelli Bashar working for Kyoto News, a Japanese news agency.

You said to the council that you're going to visit Japan next month.

And I would like to know what you're going to tell Japan and what you expect from them.

And the second question is about ASEAN countries.

To which extent do you interact with them and do you have their support?

Because hearing what Indonesia or Thailand said at the Council, they are sceptical about at least some points in your report.

So to which extent do you engage with them?

Thank you.

Very good questions.

Number one, yes, I do engage with them and the, and I wanted to make sure that everyone understood and I made this point in my oral presentation, that in addition to being critical of of some of the things that were taken, as a matter of fact, the **** Commissioner has called for a moratorium on deportation, deportation, sending people back in the conflict areas.

And we have significant evidence that this is happening, that people are being sent Malaysia, Thailand.

I mean, there are evidence that that people are at grave risk by being sent back into the conflict areas from which they escaped.

So at the same time, there's lots of very positive things that are being done.

Refugee centres, you know, Malaysia has been, has been serving and protecting thousands and thousands of people.

And they've been very outspoken.

Malaysia has, as has Indonesia and been critical of the junta and the, and the violence and the, the violations that have occurred.

To be perfectly frank with you, ASEAN has, has been divided in terms of what they've been saying, various governments have been saying and how willing they are to be critical of what's been happening inside of inside of Myanmar.

But, but clearly ASEAN can and will play a very critically important role.

Indonesia has been outspoken in its, in its concern for human rights and concern about the violations that have occurred inside of Myanmar.

And, and I'm very hopeful that they will be stepping forward, particularly in their role as the, as the chair of this year to play a very important role in moving this seven to five point consensus forward.

I hope to visit Indonesia.

I visited Malaysia last last year.

I learned a great deal.

I was not allowed to see the detention centres that were housing people from me and more, but I was not allowed to engage with the home ministry on the, on the forced deportations that that were occurring.

But I did engage with, with, with many, I engaged with people from Myanmar that were in the country.

I engaged with the Foreign Ministry, many officials, they're members of the of the assembly and I learned, I learned a great deal as far as Japan is concerned.

And, and, and I was in the Republic of Korea.

And I think the Republic of Korea and certainly Japan has traditionally had a very strong role, engaging role in, in Myanmar in a variety of ways.

And I think that they can play these countries, Japan in particular, can play a very, very important role in, in, in, in this crisis.

My, my goal in Japan is to learn.

They have enormous amount of experience and connections and understanding of the crisis.

And so I want to learn from them what, what has their experience glean for them?

What insights, what information might be valuable and important for me?

How might I function not just in terms of what I'm doing now publicly talking, but also what can I do privately?

What, what, what ways can I engage with whom in a, in a, in a private sphere?

So that's what I'm looking for with respect to my trip.

And, and the thing that I'm hopeful is that particularly democracies such as strong democracies such as Japan, such as the Republic of Korea will be outspoken about this so-called election that it will that they will not, they will refuse to recognise it as an election and that they will not do what is sometimes done.

I mean, I've, I've done election observation, I've done a democracy assistance to a number of countries around the world over the years.

And there will be a, you know, some people will say, well, if there's going to be an election, you know, perhaps we can provide some assistance, information, guidance.

I'm urging democracies to not do that because to do that would be to legitimise something that is inherently illegitimate.

And it would be aiding and abetting all that comes from that illegitimate entity, this, this, this military junta.

So I'm hoping that we can that the juntas attempt to take advantage of what they could they they see as a some countries wanting to turn the page, some countries wanting to engage.

Perhaps, you know, the way things were in the past, that they will not be allowed to get away with this ruse that they're going to try to perpetrate, that they're going to have a democratic election and they'll be a civilian government, and therefore now things can go back to normal.

There's none of that is true.

And I'm hoping that strong democracies in particular will step forward to renounce and ****** this and not assist it in any way.

Thank you, Mr Andrews.

Now we have a question online from Laurence Ciero.

Yeah, thank you.

Laurence Ciero, Swiss News agency, Thank you for the press conference.

Beyond the violation of the military regime that you extensively mentioned, you also briefly in one sentence this morning alluded to violation which might be attributed to opposition groups.

So I'd like you to elaborate a little bit on, on that.

Thank you.

I, I, I don't, I don't have any specific examples or incidences to, to, to share.

But I have heard reports that they will be the targeting of people, for example, that are identified as being colluding with the, the junta.

Those that have been serving as what the, some of the opposition groups will consider to be agents of the, of the hunter, informers of the junta.

And there have been reports that I've received that there have been, you know, extradition violence against some of these individuals because they're identified with the with, with the, the hunter, with the, the Tabata door.

This is the point I made was that this is unacceptable, that a human rights violation is a human rights violation, regardless of who perpetuates it.

I've spoken to the National Unity government about these reports.

I know that they have taken some action, that they have made it very clear to everyone who's involved in opposition that this is completely unacceptable and that those who are involved in such incidences will be held fully accountable.

So I thought it very important that in addition to pointing out the obvious human rights violations that that are occurring in Myanmar by the Tatmuda, that that is the the military, the junta forces, that that also I make it clear that human rights violations by the opposition are also unacceptable.

Thank you.

Mr Andrews.

Are there any other questions?

Yes, there were persistent rumours of plans for some kind of trial repatriation of Rohingyas last year and one of the NGOs in the dialogue today also alluded to that.

Do you do you have any information to indicate that that's actually gathering any kind of momentum and is any realistic possibility in the near future?

Well, repatriation is something that is talked about a lot, certainly from Bangladesh, that they are eager for the day when conditions are right for the, the, the anger to go back home, the anger who I have spoken with, including at the camps in Bangladesh where I was a year ago, December would like nothing more than to go home.

But they want to go home and they want to be safe and they want to go home and they want to have, you know, fundamental rights respected.

And the conditions for the safe, dignified return to their homes just simply do not exist.

And I would, and I'm discouraging anyone and everyone from engaging in any activity that would repatriate anyone into these conditions.

It's just not safe.

And they're a friend of mine who's one of the organisations, advocate organisations for, for the Ray Inga, Tunkin from who works out of London, said.

Look, you got to understand that the Ray Inga are in Bangladesh are facing an impossible situation.

You know, they're living in horrific conditions inside of these camps.

And now their food rations are being cut even beyond what they've they've been.

So it's a choice between either continuing to be in these conditions or take great risk, including going back over the over the border.

Last year, 3500, Rayinga escaped and and most of them families putting their lives in the hands, families lives in the hands of these human traffickers and they were put on boats, many of them or they went overland, but many of them went on on boats.

And we know that many of those boats never made it.

We know that at least 350 people died.

And one of the points that was being made by several people I spoke with in these camps in the, in recent days was that, look, you, you, you don't understand, this is not just about nutrition when it comes to these cuts.

It's about danger.

And there's a, there's a, there's a palpable sense that that the, the camps are getting more dangerous and that there is going to be even greater pressure to, to escape.

So I think it's, we can fully expect there to be more violence in the camps because of this trend, this, this horrible trend.

And I think we can fully expect that there's going to be more people getting on these boats.

And I, you know, and I called last year for a talk about coordination, A coordinated effort among the various navies to be on the lookout for these, these, these craft that are not very seaworthy to, to, to save lives.

And, and I, I'm afraid that there was not a lot of coordination with respect to that.

But I think we can fully expect that people are going to be thinking about going back even under these horrific conditions or just going over the, over the border and going into boats and, and taking their chances.

As as someone said to me, or you know, it may be better for me to take my chances at sea than to than to starve here in in in these in these camps.

I mean nothing specific about a repatriation effort and organised repatriation.

I mean Bangladeshi government pressuring people to do that.

And again, we keep hearing that the UN is in discussion on it.

I mean, the UN can't presumably be involved, but do you hear anything to suggest that that kind of a repatriation is being organised or is imminent?

I've heard that, you know, and I various points along the way, I've heard discussions, well, maybe we can have a, a pilot programme and I've heard that those discussions in the last few weeks, but it's not new.

I mean, I've heard these in the past and they, there's a discussion of, well, maybe we could, you know, find people who would want to go over, you know, into, into, into, into Myanmar.

Of course, they, they talk about transition centres, which are nothing more than internment camps.

And if you have any doubt about that, in Sit Way in Rakhine State and I visited these camps, these these transition camps, there are 130,000 people in a internment camp in Sit Way that was called in 2012 a transition camp.

So these people have been in this horrific camp, this internment camp for now, well over a decade.

And so the suggestion that people are going to go from Bangladesh to this transition centre just brings to mind existing transition centres that are nothing more than horrific internment camps.

I, I'll tell you, I had a man, I was there maybe 5 or 6 years ago in one of the, in, in Segway and, and, and went to the camp, one of the camps.

And I had an elderly man and, and I told him that I was from the United States and I was at the time doing some research to brief the members of the United States Congress on what was going on in, in with the right Inga many years ago.

And this man said to me, he said, look, please tell them to help us.

And if they can't help us, bomb us.

I would rather die than to continue to live under these conditions.

So that's what we're talking about for transition centres.

And so I've heard this before, you know, I've, I've seen plans for transition, but I, I strongly urge anyone to, to not go under these conditions.

And there's, and no one is suggesting that, that I've heard of anyway that people are going to be able to go.

They're going to be assured of being safe.

They're going, it's going to be, it's going to be dignified.

It's going to and they're going to have their rights respected, their human rights respected.

The conditions just don't exist for that to happen.

Thank you, Mr Andrews, any other questions?

I don't see any hands out.

There are no further questions.

We will close this press conference.

Thank you very much for attending.

Thanks very much.

I really appreciate it.